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vtxfrog

WELL THIS JUST SUCKS

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vtxfrog

[user=1920]clancyp[/user] wrote:

As a retired Cop i know from experience if you want to fight

the town hall A________ then you have to hit them below the

belt GET THE PRESS INVOLVED NOTHING WORKS BETTER.

Clancy

thought about that but none of them seem to be interested in the injustice being done here since they made most of them made stories before about how elkhart was doing something to stop the noise......

 

my next thought was going out and video taping my on footage for this prick and making my own video clip for you tube and posting it everywhere.....

 

does anyone remember the tv show THE DUKE OF HAZZARD.....

 

well welcome to the new HAZZARD OF ELKHART we have mayor Richard MOORE playing the roll of BOSS HOG and his faithful stuge ROSSCO P. COALTRAIN is play by our own CRPL MIKE BOGART

 

this is going to be the basis of the video

 

but to your comment of the press i am in process of a nice bit for our local paper

 

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plskthompson

If you make a video, make sure he knows it before you do. I don't remember if it was here or on another forum, but a man was arrested and prosecuted for having a helmet cam and posting the video on you tube with an undercover officer's voice on it. They said it violated his right to privacy. It didn't matter that he was on the side of a hwy, and the camera was on the guys helmet.

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vtxfrog

gotcha.... thanks johnny......

 

but i was gonna do something of a butcher job of web photos that way they are old pics with a new twist just gonna add in comintary and headlines.... more like a nerated slideshow type thing...

 

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Cactus_Jack

Just remember there frog a LEO may take something to the extremes but all he's doing in enforcing a law that the city government has passed (specially if he's the only tasked with enforcing this one). It really sounds like the law itself is the problem way to vague and subject to a very broad interpretation.

 

I know someone mentioned the AMA another to look at is see if you have an A.B.A.T.E. chapter around your area or state.

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vtxfrog

[user=511]Cactus_Jack[/user] wrote:

Just remember there frog a LEO may take something to the extremes but all he's doing in enforcing a law that the city government has passed (specially if he's the only tasked with enforcing this one). It really sounds like the law itself is the problem way to vague and subject to a very broad interpretation.

 

I know someone mentioned the AMA another to look at is see if you have an A.B.A.T.E. chapter around your area or state.

yeh i know jack i am working and tring to get the city ordance changed with the city council..... and i know he is just doing a job......

 

but he doesn't need to be the smug prick that he is about it.....

 

pretty sad when the people you work with don't even like you or what you are doing....( these coments were made by his fellow officers on the same force ) realy sad

 

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Joep

well remember that you may not bedoing something against the law or privacy but... you can beat the rap.. but you can't beat the ride (to the iron bar hotel)

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vtxfrog

okay guys i need some feed back on this

 

courtnotice.jpg

 

maybe i am reading this wrong but it sounds like to me that they already have me convicted before i even get into court

 

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Hodgy

.

 

 

You probably missed the "Pay by" date and that is the summons to court,

 

I think ?

 

 

.

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waltja02

Nah they just gotta tell the court what "you did" and what law or ordinanace you violated. They still have to prove by a proponderance of the evidence that you did what they say.

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topgun

when did the 250 fine become 2500 for 1 offense?

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Cactus_Jack

Indiana has some weird thoughts on things such as

 

IF YOU DO NOT APPEAR, judgement by default August be entered against you....

 

What the hell does August have to do with that statement?

 

I'd hope that is a typo on the amount of the fine but to me it looks like they are multiplying the fine by 100 there. Also looks more and more like you sound get a lawyer for that court date.

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Joep

nah... not convicted ... they include that as the penalty they are seeking.. It letsd the court know how they are proceeding and what conclusion they are desireing...

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waltja02

My guess is that it is just a generic form. They have no idea if he has been convicted of this offence before. They are just making sure that they get all the money they think they are due.

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vtxfrog

ITS OVER!!!!!

 

after spending a but load of time on the phone with a couple different atturny's it boils down to this the city will WIN regaurdless..... it is there opinion that there was a disturbing noise and no matter how many tests and or video's i can produce to show that my bike meets and complies with fedral requierments..... the city can still say it makes a noise that we do not except...... and hit me with a higher fine than $250 and still have to pay court cost on top of that....

 

am i pissed.......:tap: :tap: HELL YEH :rage::rage: :rage: but i can only do so much but i am working with the president of our city council to maybe get this revised so it is more of a equal playing feild for all insted of a one way for the city winnig......

 

well that is it it is paid and done with......... but the fight will go on i just won't be in court to do it

 

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mespock

I can't see how this can be ...

 

In WI when you are fined you get a court date to appear and plead. Fine is due on the date unless you plead not guilty.

 

A not guilty plead gets you a date with the DA who will then give you offers if you want to accept.

 

Then you get the hearing ... It's the law ... Not at your cost.

 

Hmmm ... this is where you need to find an attorney who is looking to make a name for themselves. I can't see you losing this ... You could even take this to a higher court.

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Devans

[user=25]mespock[/user] wrote:

I can't see how this can be ...

 

In WI when you are fined you get a court date to appear and plead. Fine is due on the date unless you plead not guilty.

 

A not guilty plead gets you a date with the DA who will then give you offers if you want to accept.

 

Then you get the hearing ... It's the law ... Not at your cost.

 

That is how it is here also. That is exactly how my ticket went. I was never received a summons or nothing else. On the date the ticket was due to be paid, I went to court, plead not guilty and was given a later court date. At the later date I spoke with the DA who said the Deputy was wrong. She went in the court, told the judge and I paid $30 in court costs and went home.

 

The summons nor the possible additional fine and court costs makes no sense to me either :baffled::baffled:

 

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AspectTwo

Well Froggy, that's how things happen down South as well unfortunately. Now you will usually get a reprieve on paying if you go to court and plead NOT GUILTY. However, if it's against the city or the state you usually have to be having BBQ with the governor regularly to get anywhere. Otherwise you are just compounding the fines with court fees and whatever else they want to tack onto it. That is UNLESS they take you to the pokey for the initial offense - then it's up to the state or the local sherriff's dept. on how they want to bail you out and IF.

 

I know that you've heard in the South they'll put you UNDER the jail and they shall until you come up with a LOT o' cash OR someone real (like the Mayor or Governor) that will take care of it. What a Witch!! :rage::tap: However sometimes it's just better to cut your losses and move on. DON'T advocate that but in the practical you just have to do it!

 

Here you have to contact the ACLU and get someone on board....don't even like them when they're on my side really. SUCKS! :rage::smack::doh:

 

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vtxfrog

[user=25]mespock[/user] wrote:

I can't see how this can be ...

 

In WI when you are fined you get a court date to appear and plead. Fine is due on the date unless you plead not guilty.

 

A not guilty plead gets you a date with the DA who will then give you offers if you want to accept.

 

Then you get the hearing ... It's the law ... Not at your cost.

 

Hmmm ... this is where you need to find an attorney who is looking to make a name for themselves. I can't see you losing this ... You could even take this to a higher court.

yeh thats what i thought as well but i was proven wrong the so called judge in this matter is no judge he is a mediator and so far since they started this crap they have had 2 people aculy get close to having the case droped they just wound up with a smaller fine but that is 2 people out of almost 600 that went into court so that is telling me thta the deck is stacked way to high in there favor...... and i didn't like those odds.....

 

yeh i thought i had a strong case and still do ... but i did find out that i ruffled some feathers the officer that wrote me the ticket heard that i have been all over town talking to the city council the cheif of police and the mayor's office.... but like berta said i decided to cut my loss's and run before i get more tacked on.....

 

but like i said i am still planing on working with our council to change what is wrong.....

 

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mespock

Well you can take this further ... There is TV and always some reporter who is looking into this crap. Ever try the "Daily Show" they have issues like this frequently on the program about communities that have ridiculous laws. Would give the issue national attention.

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Roleketu

I understand your frustration in fighting your city over the noise issue. As I posted earlier the Massachusetts Motorcycle Association (MMA) has been fighting the legal battle in our state on such issues. First you need to get past the police officer's attitude. He simply is doing his job no matter how much he is a jerk doing it. The city wrote laws, he enforces the laws. Don't battle with the police, battle with the law makers or the agency's that determine whether a law is fair or un-constitutional. As a single person you probably won't get far. An organized well thought out fight in the legal system is the way.

 

Here are a couple of news clips from the MMA website showing the results of MMA efforts to fight legislation on noise from motorcycles.

 

 

AGO Rejects Falmouth Town Warrant regarding Motorcycle Sound Enforcement Wednesday, July 14, 2010 FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

MMA Information Update - AGO Rejects Falmouth Town Warrant regarding Motorcycle Sound Enforcement

 

The Massachusetts Motorcycle Association is pleased to announce to its membership that the Massachusetts Attorney General’s Office has denied the recent Town of Falmouth Noise Ordinance concerning increasing penalties pertaining to sound emissions from Motorcycles.]

 

In early April, Falmouth heard numerous warrants in their annual town meeting across 3 nights, and hastily enacted a “Loud Vehicles ByLaw†as written in Article 25 of the Town Meeting Warrant. The very limited number of motorcyclists in attendance were unable to fend off the adoption of this Bylaw which lifts verbiage directly from Massachusetts General Law Chapter 90, Section 16 (90-16) and increased the fines while in the process.]

 

Realizing that the ordinance could not become law without approval by the Massachusetts Attorney General’s Office (AGO), the MMA next took its case directly to that office re-stating its opposition to this legislation due to the subjective nature used to decide if your motorcycle is legal and the various other elements of conflict with the MGL.]

 

After significant review by the AGO denied the bylaw amendment for all the reasons previously argued by the MMA and its members who were in attendance at the town meeting.]

 

The MMA expresses its appreciation to the riders of Falmouth who were vigilant in their opposition, and to the Attorney General’s Office for their extreme diligence and careful review of the facts.]

 

The MMA also extends its request to its members and all Motorcyclists to ride with respect in local communities by ensuring they are riding with mufflers pursuant to the MGL and are keeping the throttle down.]

 

For More Information, see http://www.massmotorcycle.org or contact LegislativeDirector@MassMotorcycle.org

 

 

MMA Announcement concerning the North Hampton, New Hampshire Noise Ordinance Friday, July 02, 2010 The MMA is publishing this announcement for all members riding in the North Hampton NH area!

 

North Hampton Business Association Update:

 

On Thursday, June 24th, the following organizations met at Seacoast Harley Davidson to discuss the subject of the North Hampton, New Hampshire Noise Ordinance:

 

- Town Manager, Steve Fournier

- Selectboard Members Rineman and Meggiore Four members of the Harley Davidson staff including John Magongle, Al Contoise and two members of the MAX BMW dealership including General Manager Frank Margolis, Don Jeka, owner of Greatbay Motorcycles

- Chief of Police Brian Page and his Deputy Peter McNamara

- President of the New Hampshire Auto Dealers Association (NHADA)

- Rick Fucci, Bert Garry and Jim Better from the NHBA

 

The Noise Ordinance Citizens Petition (Article 26 on the ballet) will go into force on July 11th making it illegal to park or operate a motorcycle in North Hampton that does not display an approved EPA sticker on its exhaust system or on some other location on the motorcycle.

 

The Police Department will not be enforcing the law due to an insurance company determination that the law is illegal and therefore, the Police Department would not be protected from suits as a result of enforcement efforts.

 

The Police Department intends to continue to enforce existing state law pertaining to all excessive noise (over 106 decibels) whether from motorcycles or other sources.

 

Town officials are contemplating two actions: ask the EPA for a ruling on the matter or bring the issue to a court for a declaratory judgment.

 

The NHADA is contemplating filing an injunction to stop the ordinance from becoming law on July 11th. They also made it clear that they will be using their legal defense fund to help the motorcycle dealerships with the issue.

 

The result is that, although there will be a new law relative to motorcycle noise, nothing will be done to enforce the new rules until an EPA or State Court ruling is rendered.

 

For more information please email northhamptonbiz@gmail.com

 

About the North Hampton Business Association:

The North Hampton Business Association was established to promote and preserve local businesses, the heritage of the Town, and to promote the Town as a vital part of the Twenty-First Century.

 

We work closely with all members of the Town Government to ensure that the Association's interests are heard and protected.

 

As an Association, we believe it is important to be involved in our community, which continues to support the local community.

 

To that end, the Association is dedicated to providing its members with up to date knowledge of the Town's present and future activities to ensure that the Association, the Town and its residents thrive and grow together.

 

 

 

MMA UPDATE-BOSTON SOUND ORDINANCE Wednesday, May 05, 2010 MMA UPDATE-BOSTON SOUND ORDINANCE

Monday, May 3, 2010, the Boston Globe printed an editorial entitled, Motorcycles “Loud Pipes, Real Gripes†in and around Boston: http://www.boston.com/yourtown/arlington/articles/2010/05/03/motorcycles_loud_pipes_real_gripes/?comments=all#readerComm

 

With the release of this new appeal by the Boston Globe, the MMA urges ALL RIDERS who find themselves cited to immediately contact the MMA at LegislativeDirector@MassMotorcycle.org with details concerning the citation. The MMA is committed to support its members in the fight against this legislation.

 

The “Boston Noise Ordinance†is based on the existence of an EPA embossed “stamp†on a motorcycle that purportedly signifies compliance with “factory sound emission†standards. Massachusetts State Law does not require your motorcycle carry this EPA stamp and the MMA challenges Boston’s attempt to regulate motorcycle riders through this flawed legislation.

 

As previously reported by the MMA, Boston passed this “noise ordinance†on June 3, 2009, saw an injunction issued in July 2009, and then saw the 3rd party lawsuit challenging this ordinance dismissed on March 26, 2010.

 

In contrast to the intimation by City Councilor Sal LaMattina, no citations have yet been issued by the Boston Police since the ordinance went into effect. The “focus†actually refers to an awareness campaign in which Boston Traffic Enforcement left pamphlets concerning Motorcycle Noise on bikes parked in the city.

 

Acknowledging that responsibility begins with the rider, the MMA reminds Riders that motorcycle sound levels are easily controlled and discretion is urged in urban and evening environments, when sound levels are most noticeable. Riders are also reminded to remain vigilant and notify MMA Officials each and every time local noise ordinances or bylaws are proposed in their communities.

 

For more information, contact LegislativeDirector@MassMotorcycle.org or visit http://www.MassMotorcycle.org

 

 

 

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Roleketu

So, the above three news articles show how organized legal battles can result in changes. If you don't have a motorcycle association it maybe time to start one. As one of the articles show, motorcycle dealers are places where you can get support. They have a stake in how laws effect their sales. And one of the biggest things MMA suggests to their members is to respect where you ride and throttle down. One can understand the ole lady sitting outside her house on a sunny day only to hear constant roar of loud pipes past her house. She is one of the locals that complain to her city and help create noise ordinances.

 

Good luck in your battles.

 

And I'll stick with my 86 GL1200 Aspencade, it would be a riot if anyone tried to write this bike up as loud.

 

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Roleketu

So, the above three news articles show how organized legal battles can result in changes. If you don't have a motorcycle association it maybe time to start one. As one of the articles show, motorcycle dealers are places where you can get support. They have a stake in how laws effect their sales. And one of the biggest things MMA suggests to their members is to respect where you ride and throttle down. One can understand the ole lady sitting outside her house on a sunny day only to hear constant roar of loud pipes past her house. She is one of the locals that complain to her city and help create noise ordinances.

 

Good luck in your battles.

 

And I'll stick with my 86 GL1200 Aspencade, it would be a riot if anyone tried to write this bike up as loud.

 

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Cactus_Jack

[user=870]Roleketu[/user] wrote:

And I'll stick with my 86 GL1200 Aspencade, it would be a riot if anyone tried to write this bike up as loud.

It seems the way Elkhart's law is written even a goldwing could easily get a ticket, I'd bet I can still hear something at 35 even if it's a bit of tire noise.

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vtxfrog

to late there jack... a wing did get it about a week or so ago when he came to a stop light he forgot to trun down the radio and got nail for a noise ordance.....

 

 

 

anybody have the phone number to the talaban maybe they could come and bomb elkhart.....

 

 

 

JUST A JOKE PEOPLE....... JUST A JOKE.......

 

THIS IS NOT A THREAT OF ANY KIND

 

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Geezerglider
Frog, I think your avatar pretty well sums up your city.

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